So where do we go from here?

Or "what the fuck do you care?", part 3.

And/or, "why truth matters", part 2.


Now, given the forgoing, where do we go from here?

Well, takes me right back to the first rant.

Opening up the discourse on religion.

It's what the founders, at least Tom Paine wanted, that's why he wrote The Age Of Reason, that's why it exists, that's why I have his works linked on my sidebar.

Ah, but surely he lost the debate, right?
Nope.
Just bullied.
Reputation ruined with slander, and a campaign to try to erase him from the historical record.
Someone even stole his fucking bones.

But there you go, religion has always been virulently hostile to dissent.

It's why Jefferson kept his views in the closet, to be released only until after his death.

Rule by fear, not very democratic, or open minded.

Again, I point to the Taliban.

That how we wanna be, America?
Hmm?
Not me.
No more of this.

It's debate or war, and if the latter, that's the side you'd have to join.
I don't see anyone raising their hands for it (well, your John Walker Lindhs maybe) , so discourse it must be.

If religion wants to put its ideas up on the public table, for things like prop 8, abortion, evolution in schools, birth control, etc, etc, then guess what?
Those ideas are up for inspection, debate, dissection, and yes, if found lacking and fallacious, ridicule.

And given the logic problems I've laid out in this rant alone, it'll be an uphill slog for the believer.
But so be it.
"I just believe it", doesn't get a free pass anymore.
Especially when deciding on the liberties of other human beings.

And the free pass wasn't properly earned anyway, as with the example of Tom Paine, it was bullied, and weaseled, and why do the modern faithful want to be the inheritors of that legacy?

Laziness at best, wickedness at worst.
But, call me starry eyed, I think people are and can be better than that, so, if these propositions are truly worthy to take part in our system, let them earn their place with truly open debate.

But again, it would be an uphill slog for the faithful, but so be it.

Or, else they can frame their propositions with secular arguments.
That one would really be better for everyone.

But for some propositions, I'm not holding my breath.
But, prove me wrong.

Ah, but why ridicule?
As I pointed out previously, when it's political opinion, the fur flies.
Take the "vilest", thing you think you've heard about Christianity, and substitute "Liberalism", and it doesn't make you flinch.

So, either the non-believer has to hang his head and shut up,..which, is no longer acceptable for all the above reasons, OR, we can elevate the discourse across the board.
Hmm?
No?
Well...*shrug*.

Also, the discourse is already opened up for the other guy's religion/superstition.
Seems like Atheism is the last taboo.
And there's really no rational reason.
Just culture.

Oh, and as evidence that this entitled bullying attitude hasn't gone away, just look to Glenn Beck's little crocodile tear soaked "we surround them", movement.

Who's "them"?

And what is this little Mickey Mouse Club going to do with the surrounded?
Demand surrender?
Will there be terms?
Or will it be some sort of Waco situation?

Well, let's look at his 9 principles, and 12 values, shall we?
Oh, let's.
What fun.

1. America is good.

Not always. When it's not, it needs criticizing.
Sounds like "my country right or wrong".
Sounds like crushing dissent.
Sounds like more of the same tedious stuff I nailed in the original "meaningless slogans".

2. I believe in God and He is the Center of my Life.

Ah, I knew it, Atheists aren't invited to the little Mickey Mouse Club.

I presume this is the dissent meant to be crushed. Same bullshit, different day.

3. I must always try to be a more honest person than I was yesterday.

Honest like trying to build your career off 9/11 after slamming 9/11 victim families, Glenn?

Yeah...

4. The family is sacred. My spouse and I are the ultimate authority, not the government.

Okay...what does this mean?

The government is busting in to make your kids eat their vegetables?

Or, is it you want to beat your kids across the eyes with a belt, and you claim that as a holy right?

Or something in between?

Without specifics, this is meaningless dribble at best, ominous paranoid bile at worst.

5. If you break the law you pay the penalty. Justice is blind and no one is above it.

Another weird one. The law of the land, or "God's law"? If the former, um, no shit. Who the hell is stumping for "crime is good!!"??

6. I have a right to life, liberty and pursuit of happiness, but there is no guarantee of equal results.

Well, that one's obvious to decipher, no commies.

7. I work hard for what I have and I will share it with who I want to. Government cannot force me to be charitable.

"Mine!!! Mine!! Mine!!", ayep, no commies. Also, no welfare, or any other program randomly decided is evil.

Without specifics, this is mindless propaganda. But, so's the whole dopey list, that's why lists mostly suck for anything beyond harmless cutesie crap like a magazine's favorite movies.

8. It is not un-American for me to disagree with authority or to share my personal opinion.

Oh, I agree, Glenn, so why are Atheists excluded from your little love list?

Or hell, why are commies? Last I checked, they have a right to their opinions.

Hmm, and it seems to contradict rule 1.

Oh, right, only the government can be evil, not the plot of land, or douchebag cable news pundits, or Chuck Norris.

9. The government works for me. I do not answer to them, they answer to me.

Oh, agreed, too bad we can't join hands in brotherhood like on 9/12, because you kicked me out of the club on rule 2, and anyone who just plain disagrees with Glenn Beck on rule 1.

Well, my gorge is bubbling, let's look at the 12 values now...

Honesty.

Uh huh, okay, with ya....

Reverence.

Ope, there we go, I'm kicked out of the club again. from either direction, dang.

Hope.

With ya.

Thrift.

Sure.

Humility.

Okey-dokey.

Charity.

When I got some extra to give,...well, I'll throw some at the RDF *mischievous wink*

Sincerity.

Are you kidding me? Look at these rants. I'm opening a vein here.

Moderation.

(Face full of pie) *burp* what?

Hard work.

All righty.

Courage.

Ditto the sincerity comment.

Personal responsibility.

Kay.

Gratitude.

Ayuh.

Well, again, Atheists aren't on the love list, so, either there's a forthcoming 8/11 club for us to be patriotic with Glenn, or we don't count as Americans.

I won't hold my breath on the former, and assume the latter.

So, there you go, we're "the surrounded", and there's nothing to that that isn't a threat, and points out the attitude I've been railing against.

This is what the operators of the bullshit machine do.

Well, sorry, it's debate and dissent that are American, and it's not just open to batshit blubberers that want the government to crumble, and for people on welfare to curl up and die.

This is the mess that's been made of our discourse, and politics, folks.

Time to take it back.

Not for one group, but everyone.

And fuck "surrounding", people, let's just chip at the bullshit.

Enough already. Enough of the tears, enough of the fear, enough of the assholes.

THAT'S why I fucking care.